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news
"No one cares if you've won three, four, five Vueltas": Geraint Thomas weighs in on Jumbo-Visma leadership debate; "Always been there": CyclingMikey rubbishes claim that camera cyclists cause more hatred + more on the live blog
SUMMARY
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Geraint Thomas (Zac Williams/SWpix.com)15 September 2023, 11:40
"Spain's for holidays, not riding a bike": Geraint Thomas weighs in on Roglič leadership debate, says "no one cares if you've won three, four, five Vueltas"
[Luis Angel Gomez/SprintCyclingAgency©2023]
Geraint Thomas and Luke Rowe discussed Jumbo-Visma's leadership struggle on the latest edition of their Watts Occurring' podcast, Thomas taking aim at Primož Roglič's apparent ambition to ride his own race, leaving Sepp Kuss behind on the Angliru stage earlier this week.
Jumbo-Visma have since settled on a whole team strategy of course, Kuss getting the help of Jonas Vingegaard and Roglič after something of a PR meltdown on Wednesday evening. Summing up the situation, Thomas joked: "Spain's for holidays, not riding a bike" and said Vingegaard has more to gain from winning a maiden Vuelta than his Slovenian teammate adding a fourth red jersey to his collection.
Thomas yesterday said he thought Kuss "deserves more respect" from the teammates he has helped on so many occasions and, during the podcast, added that Roglič "got nothing" out of pushing on and leaving Kuss.
"[On the Angliru] he continues to ride, maybe he was hoping to drop Jonas as well. He would have won the stage if he had backed off 10 watts and let Sepp stay in the wheel," Thomas said. "I'd say Jonas has more to achieve, as in, by winning the Vuelta he'd get more from it than Primož winning a fourth. Let's be honest, no one really cares if you've won three, four, five Vueltas. Spain's for holidays, not riding a bike..."
There was one major talking point on last night's pod: #JumboGate
Listen now to get the full thoughts of @GeraintThomas86 and @LukeRowe1990 on the wild last few days at #LaVuelta23 pic.twitter.com/FSz1S7P796
— Watts Occurring (@Watts_Occurring) September 15, 2023
What about riding your bike while on holiday in Spain, G? That's a question we need answered...
15 September 2023, 15:27
Alberto Dainese wins Vuelta a España sprint
What. A. Finish. 🔥
After a collision in the final 2km, it's Alberto Dainese who wins Stage 19 of #LaVuelta23 pic.twitter.com/wQ2GHl1BMD
— Eurosport (@eurosport) September 15, 2023
So close for that Filippo Ganna sprint win, just pippo-ed (see what I did there?) on the line by compatriot Alberto Dainese who in turn secured a very underrated achievement of a third consecutive Grand Tour where he's won a stage. That despite most of his dsm-firmenich teammates ending up in the crash that ended Kaden Groves' chances.
Tomorrow we go climbing one final time before Sunday's sprint procession in Madrid.
15 September 2023, 14:43
Almost a third of Glaswegians estimated to have watched UCI Cycling World Championships
Glasgow SNP councillor Chris Cunningham has called the World Championships a "huge success", and estimated that 190,000 Glaswegians watched the event in their home city, Glasgow Live reports.
"If you look the numbers for the elite men's race on the Sunday, it was estimated that 190,000 Glaswegians came out on the streets and watched that event," he said. "It confirms the extent to which the event was a huge success for the city."
A pre-event survey had suggested that just 18 per cent of residents intended to go watch the road race events, the same survey showing that 43 percent knew Glasgow was hosting the event, and 74 per cent saying they believed it would have a positive effect on the city.
15 September 2023, 14:00
Conservative MP claims cycling routes has turned city into a "ghost town"
15 September 2023, 12:22
New bikes from... Specialized, Giant, Liv, Wilier, Bianchi, Trek and Ridley
It's International New Bike Release Week' apparently. As much so I can keep up as informing you lot, here's everything that's been launched in the past seven days... *deep breath*...
> Giant launches "lighter, smoother and more efficient" Defy endurance road bike: first ride
> Bianchi combines light weight and aero credentials with updated Specialissima road bike
> Wilier introduces cheaper versions of Filante aero road bike
> All new Roubaix SL8 is the "smoothest" and fastest endurance road bike ever, claims Specialized
> Trek lightens entry-level Domane AL road bikes
> Ridley combines light weight and aerodynamics on new Falcn RS road bike
And breathe... for a 'fun' Friday night drinking game, take a sip every time a bike brand says its new release is lighter, faster or stiffer. road.cc cannot take responsibility for any hangover that results from playing this game...
15 September 2023, 12:07
Councillors slam "ludicrous" and "cockamamie" idea of cycling path next to elderly people's club and children's park
15 September 2023, 09:43
"The hatred has always been there": CyclingMikey rubbishes claim that camera cyclists cause more hatred towards bicycle riders
It's been another week where Jeremy Vine's cycling videos have attracted millions of views and prompted thousands upon thousands of comments and replies in the never-ending social media discussion about camera cyclists.
> Jeremy Vine's lucky escape as bike run over by reversing driver who turned onto cycle lane
Perhaps the most famous sharer of cycling camera footage CyclingMikey has spoken about perhaps the most often heard accusation about those who record dangerous driving and road offences on their rides — 'it just increases hatred of cyclists'...
Last night Mikey, real name Mike van Erp, who has reported thousands of drivers using his GoPro footage, replied to the accusation, saying the "hatred has always been there" towards cyclists.
> Here's what to do if you capture a near miss, close pass or collision on camera while cycling
"All the people thinking that camera cyclists cause hatred. No, friend. You haven't cycled in the days before cameras. The hatred has always been there. Now at least cameras tame drivers to some degree. They don't fix everything, but they certainly don't make it worse. Unless you're the convicted driver. Then it's worse for you only."
What do you think?
15 September 2023, 10:14
The drama continued long into the night at La Vuelta
A organização da Vuelta passando trabalho#Lavuelta23 #ciclismonaespn pic.twitter.com/ejD3JMiA0s
— O País do Ciclismo (@opaisdociclismo) September 15, 2023
15 September 2023, 10:01
"I don't think I've ever seen this before?": 'Cyclists dismount' gets an upgrade
I don't think I've ever seen this before? 👀 Spotted in Bath. pic.twitter.com/oAKHLtwpx5
— Ben Bowskill (he/him) (@BenBowskill) September 14, 2023
Ironically, spotted in Bath, where on Wednesday we reported a councillor had taken issue with the council's 'safety' decision to install 'cyclists dismount' signs on a National Cycle Route while works are undertaken. Saskia Heijltjes pointed out the road is a "major route for cycling east to west in a low-traffic environment" and "not every person on a cycle can dismount".
> Questions asked of 'cyclists dismount' signs on national cycle route during works
Earlier this month, a campaign group for disabled cyclists called upon North East Lincolnshire Council to implement clearer signage for a town centre cycling ban. Wheels for Wellbeing said the "just get off an walk" attitude, that one councillor told local cyclists, "only works for people who can" walk their bikes.
"If you can't walk without pain or risk to your health, it's not as simple as 'just get off your bike and walk'," they said, highlighting signage seen in Wandsworth in London that instead states: 'Cyclists dismount unless a mobility aid'.
What was that? You wanted to read a feature about all the different types of cycling-related signs? Your wish is our command...
15 September 2023, 08:23
"It's an honour to have two such champions working for you": More reaction to Jumbo-Visma's civil war ceasefire
When I say 'ceasefire' I mean with each other, not the authorities, anyway, we got some quick reaction from the big three immediately after yesterday's stage, but here's what they had to say a bit later...
Sepp Kuss: "It's an honour to have two such champions working for you. They have both won some big races in the recent past. So this is a great honour. I'm glad that I was strong enough to stay at the front. I always try to stay focused, have confidence in myself and ride to the finish as fast as possible. I'm grateful for the work that Jonas and Primož did for me today. It means a lot to me. Although it might be difficult to see from the outside, we have a clear plan."
Jonas Vingegaard: "That plan was to defend Sepp's leading position. As a team, we have done that with flying colours. We are in an excellent position, but we are not there yet. Saturday's stage is treacherous. It's fantastic to be able to do something for Sepp in this way. I will always remember what he has done for me. So, I wanted to give something back. Hopefully, we can bring his red jersey to the finish line."
Primož Roglič: "I'm happy with the way things are going. Today's stage was mainly about defending our positions in the general classification. Sepp is still wearing the red jersey, which puts us in a good position. In the next few days, we still have some tests that will require us to stay focused. Winning the Vuelta would be amazing."
Dare I say a slightly more polished line from Roglič than what was heard when he was asked by the TV cameras if it has been difficult to not go for the win... "Definitely," he replied. "I have my own thoughts about it but for sure I will try to make sure it [the GC] stays the way it is."
[Images: Rafa Gomez/SprintCyclingAgency©2023]
15 September 2023, 08:21
Thomas De Gendt takes notes
That’s a way to beat Jumbo Visma.
— Thomas De Gendt (@DeGendtThomas) September 14, 2023
15 September 2023, 07:49
Bizarre Vuelta scenes as Jumbo-Visma staffer grappled to the ground by Spanish police
The drama just keeps coming for Jumbo-Visma at this Vuelta a España. As good teammates (how quickly things change) Jonas Vingegaard and Primož Roglič took Sepp Kuss' thanks for their new-found loyalty, the aftermath of yesterday's stage saw a bizarre scene unfold, captured on video by Marcelo La Gattina...
Situación en el final de etapa. La policía intentando poner orden, empujó a un auxiliar del Jumbo mientras asistía a los corredores. La situación se puso tensa y terminaron en el suelo. El asistente no fue detenido, pero se vivió un momento desagradable. #LaVuelta23 pic.twitter.com/WRKvhsKRcX
— Marcelo La Gattina (@MLaGattina) September 14, 2023
A member of Jumbo-Visma staff ending up on the floor, kicking out at three Policía Nacional officers. La Gattina reported: "The police, trying to establish order, pushed a Jumbo assistant while he was assisting the riders. The situation became tense and they ended up on the ground. The assistant was not arrested, but there was an unpleasant moment."
Another angle here:
Incidente en la línea de meta de La Vuelta.
📌 Un auxiliar de Jumbo se enzarzó con la Policía y tuvo que ser reducido en el suelo.
📌 Vingegaard ha ido después a preguntarle cómo estaba.
📌 Los agentes insistían en que las normas hay que cumplirlas.
🎥 @danielarribas96 pic.twitter.com/LzQoXVPdEA
— Relevo (@relevo) September 14, 2023
So not an investigation into crimes against Sepp...
Anyway, the scene was similar to what was seen at the finish of stage 11, on our live blog from that day, a Cofidis soigneur perhaps overzealously willing stage winner Jesús Herrada to the line... and getting tackled by police for his troubles.
La Guardia taking down the soigneur is a new one for me. Probably Remco's fault. pic.twitter.com/PQWVd7Y3WA
— How The Race Was Won® (@Cyclocosm) September 6, 2023
Cycling once again being a completely serious and normal sport.
Today should hopefully be, for someone working for a cycling website at the end of a long week, relatively straightforward and uneventful, the peloton getting a rare flat stage for the sprinters (or perhaps even one of those breakaway days that annoy the fast men when everyone's tired at the end of a tough three weeks?)
Dan is the road.cc news editor and joined in 2020 having previously written about nearly every other sport under the sun for the Express, and the weird and wonderful world of non-league football for The Non-League Paper. Dan has been at road.cc for four years and mainly writes news and tech articles as well as the occasional feature. He has hopefully kept you entertained on the live blog too.
Never fast enough to take things on the bike too seriously, when he's not working you'll find him exploring the south of England by two wheels at a leisurely weekend pace, or enjoying his favourite Scottish roads when visiting family. Sometimes he'll even load up the bags and ride up the whole way, he's a bit strange like that.
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85 comments
To go with your tiny little mind.
Apparently the UK government will ban the American Bully XL because of a danger to the public. Unfortunately, it's a dog breed, not a car model..........
They're always happy to ban dog breeds as it shows how much they care about people being attacked by them (despite the crumbling hospitals being far more of a danger to more people). More importantly, dog breeders aren't rich, powerful lobbyists.
People should wear bite suits.
It's the only way to protect yourself.
(They are some 210000 dog attacks a year with 4000 postie's suffering. In 21/22 8790 hospital admissions in England as a result of a bite or strike).
That's a lot more than I would have guessed.
Personally, I have more trouble with cats being randomly vicious than dogs, though it might be because I'm more of a "dog person" and understand their body language better.
Yes, but if it saves one person, it's clearly worth it. It should be the law that everyone must don a bite-suit to leave their house. Common sense. You wouldn't want to bitten without one, surely?
Cat communication seems to be commonly misunderstood; this may be partly their fault as they seem to be lacking a way to express "cease fire!" It's not quite the same thing but I did find this handy guide if that helps:
These zones change in nature without warning. Just remember you are likely to be wrong, the cat is right and if a cat let's you caress it anywhere on it's body you are privileged.
That spot forward of the tail is a real thing. One of our cats goes mad for it. Gets quite arsy if you stop doing it.
Get lost cats are perfect. The main thing wrong with dogs is that they're dogs and not cats and they eat other animals excrement.
Yes I am doggist. Having said that there is a dog I know and he's alright...
Lovely trucks those - and incredibly useful too.
Ah the pointlessly-massive, usally-pristine, spends-it's-whole-life-in-an-urban-environment, never-has-anything-in-the-bed mobile. Love those. Some of my favourites.
Don't forget with the double cab version like that there's also the "massive tax break as I can get a 4x4 but claim it's a work vehicle" element.
Perfect for transporting fragile egos!
Also great for visibility - you can clearly see you're higher up and better protected (A-posts) than all the other road users ... who you can't see when they get close, or move behind an A-post.
Great for manufactures' profits / salespeople's commisions too!
Slightly different take on the argument about the hatred always being there. I agree that cameras haven't increased hatred. But surely hatred is only a few decades old? In grand terms, it was only in the 1970s or so that the number of cars in the UK outnumbered the number of regular cyclists. Rather, motornormativity is a creation of the last few decades, the gerroff-my-road arguments, the assumption that car traffic is 'normal' and everything else is not, the car adverts of unrealistic empty streets, and so on.
So the question is not whether cameras increased hatred, but rather how this hatred first emerged, and how it can be reduced.
It is, of course, quite right that some disabled people use cycles as mobility aids and equally right, therefore, that equalities legislation means it can be unlawful not to make exceptions to "no cycling" rules for them. That all should be absolutely without question.
However, generally, if it's safe and ok for a disabled cyclist to use a route, in the vast majority of cases, why isn't it also safe and ok for any cyclist to use that route. (Likely volume of cycle traffic may be one reason, I guess.)
While I appreciate the 'Except disabled' sign ... how exactly am I to prove that I am disabled and exactly how disabled do I need to be?
What is the criteria here?
PiP?
Blue Badge?
Amputee?
I'm none of the above ... but still disabled.
Needs a 'not all disabilities are visible ' sign below it...
it is there but not all "not all disabilities are visible" signs are visible.
They shouldn't be requiring any proof and even if they did, wouldn't they need some kind of medical training to evaluate it. Maybe you should carry around an exemption card that simply says "None of your f***ing business".
I'm not sure that They are even allowed to ask you what your disability is, if you say you have one.
"Not all disabilities are visible" is a reminder to the curtain-twitching, pearl- clutching, neighbourhood-watch types who maintain proper seat discipline on public transport.
Exactly.
The only time that a disability needs to be known by someone else is if they're trying to ensure that your needs are being met (and they should ask first to check if their help is even wanted).
Back when I was travelling to the office, there was a blind man who caught the same train. He was one of these people that was intensely proud and self sufficient, so he'd get really angry if anyone tried to assist him without asking first. It's understandable if you're just about to get off a train and some stranger grabs your elbow to "help" you.
In a similar vein, is there a definition of a "Mobility Aid"? Aren't all bikes, almost by definition, mobility aids - in that they help their rider travel further and faster than they could on foot?
There is a legal definition for mobility aid, and unfortunately bikes are not included ... tried looking and I can't find it now.
Show 'em your scars !
I don't think they'd have that long ...
🤔
🤣🤣🤣
I've had to do it a few times on the train though.
Even had a lower leg amputee tell me it looked "fucking horrific"
Cart-before-the-horse argument. If there wasn't already a crap-load of unjustified, disproportionate hate and aggression aimed towards cyclists, none of us would feel the need to spend hundreds of pounds on cameras in the first place.
Indeed, if the hate and aggression wasn't already there, we would have had a peaceful time in this cycling specific forum prior to the video recorders becoming a common occurrence.
Alas, the proportion of users who seek to not engage, but only to spew their bile has remained distinctly constant through the years.
^^this. I'd much rather spend my hard earned cash on new shiny bits for my bike.
If I had the choice between making my bike lighter with a Hunt carbon wheelset, or making it much heavier by covering it, and me, in cameras for the same price, I’d much rather go for the wheelset. Unfortunately, UK driving standards necessitate that I go for the cameras.
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