Toughest climb in the world? Phil Gaimon smashes KOM up 90km monster; "Watch and learn, my fellow motorists": How to safely overtake a cyclist; "Unacceptable to attack our private life": Marion Rousse hits back at Patrick Lefevere + more on the live blog

Hirsute wrote:

Good old Scottish justice. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-east-fife-68347674 Twice the limit and 140 mph but can't be jailed. What is wrong with the system and is anyone going to fix it ?

Dire.  Some here will not wish to raise their blood pressure with this one.

BBC wrote:

Sheriff Steven Borthwick KC said: "It has just been pure good fortune that you didn't end up killing someone or killing yourself.

Clearly (to paraphrase Napoleon) we don't want good drivers, we want lucky drivers.

Quote:

The sheriff said he had to consider a prison sentence, but stopped short of sending Alexander [23] to jail because of his age and lack of previous convictions.

Because if you get hit by somebody who is plastered aged forty-five with a previous conviction at 140 mph you will somehow be less dead?

Not only not jailed, but only banned for 16 months!

Rendel Harris wrote:

Quote:

Ascending a quite ridiculous 4,195 m, the 89.46km climb averages 4.7 per cent. That's like Box Hill... 41 times.

Bit diminishing to dear old Box, even the shortest segment on Strava, from the bottom of ZigZag Road to the NT cafe, is 125 metres height gain, making Mauna Kea equivalent to 33 Box Hills; what I regard as the "proper" climb, from the roundabout up to the highest road point, is 167 metres, so "only" 25 times.

Does that mean if I approach Zig Zag road from the other side (as I often do) I haven't 'done' Box Hill.  (I agree about the top end, though - that drag after the cafe always catches me out!)

Fair point, I only meant "proper" as in the full extent of ZigZag Road side climb; I too nearly always approach it from the other side and then descend ZigZag, turn at the roundabout and climb back up and I would say that the long drag up from Langley Vale through Headley Common is actually harder work, generally shallower gradients (though with a couple of stinging ramps) but the sheer length of it takes more out of the legs than the few minutes (alright, the nine or ten minutes) ZigZag entails.

Rendel Harris wrote:

Fair point, I only meant "proper" as in the full extent of ZigZag Road side climb; I too nearly always approach it from the other side and then descend ZigZag, turn at the roundabout and climb back up and I would say that the long drag up from Langley Vale through Headley Common is actually harder work, generally shallower gradients (though with a couple of stinging ramps) but the sheer length of it takes more out of the legs than the few minutes (alright, the nine or ten minutes) ZigZag entails.

I was only joshing.  Though I meant approach Zig Zag road from Mickleham side (rather than from the Burford Bridge roundabout).  I very rarely approach Box Hill from the other side in the way you describe.  Actually, given how close it is to where I live, I actually rarely do Box Hill at all.

Steve K wrote:

Actually, given how close it is to where I live, I actually rarely do Box Hill at all.

I probably wouldn't if I lived close, there are plenty of less crowded climbs in the Surrey Hills that I like better, but coming from central London it makes a nice turnaround point for a 75 km ride - and the flapjacks at the NT café are particularly good…

Paul J wrote:

Good old Levefre. Worth noting that Dutch attitudes to women's lib things differ slightly to anglo-attitudes. Some ways better, some ways behind.

Isn't he Belgian?

From the Dutch side of Belgium, yes. Culturally no difference, within the gamut of cultures of the provinces of the old Netherlands. The Flemish are more dutch than Netherlanders in some respects (e.g., they speak "better" Dutch ).

The main reason Belgium exists, catholicism v reform and certain other ancient history political things are mostly irrelevant today (indeed, were never relevant to the average person in the case of some of the latter stuff).

Nation state != cultures.

As background, the modern nation state of The Netherlands" and "Vlaanderen" in Belgium were once considered part of one "Netherlands" - before we had modern nation states.

Various political things - some of which aligned with religious differences (whether out of political convience, or actual strong belief) - led to a split where a large chunk of the northern portion became its own state, no longer ruled by rulers allied with the pope. That chunk is now the modern nation state we call the Netherlands. Those same politics also affected the United Kingdom.

Culturally though, Flemish and (the state) dutch are all Netherlanders (in the old sense) and culturally dutch.

Note that most Flemish(that I know anyway) have a distinct identity as Flemish, very different to Hollanders. But then, so do many Friesians. And Fries (the Netherlandish dialect there) is a *lot* more different from Hollands dutch than Flemish dutch is to Hollands dutch.

I am butchering the history and the identities a lot, no doubt. There are many differences within the various people who speak (some dialect of) Dutch, but the commonalities are much stronger.

Rendel Harris wrote:

... strongly recommended that you engage a support vehicle both for food and water on the climb and to take you back down...

Doesn't seem quite 'cricket', carry all you need or just ride up in the car/helicopter

levestane wrote:

Rendel Harris wrote:

... strongly recommended that you engage a support vehicle both for food and water on the climb and to take you back down...

Doesn't seem quite 'cricket', carry all you need or just ride up in the car/helicopter

I'd say it's probably virtually impossible to carry all the supplies you need for such a climb (mere mortals tend to do it in somewhere around nine or ten hours), remembering that even in February, Hawaii's coolest month, the temperature is around 26°C and most of the route is in direct sunlight. Is it not cricket on a ride to stop and buy a bottle of water or a slice of cake to keep going? That's an Henri Desgrange level of harshness!

No worries buying from roadside shops, it's the extra resource use of a dedicated support vehicle that jars.

levestane wrote:

No worries buying from roadside shops, it's the extra resource use of a dedicated support vehicle that jars.

Well there is a case against to be made, but given that, as above, for safety reasons it is strongly recommend than anyone who has ridden up doesn't do the descent (only about 10% of those on Strava who've done the climb appear to have also done the descent) so the car is going anyway...the fact that he's flown to Hawaii to do it is going to be a lot more resource-heavy than having a support car.

Steve K wrote:

It's always the woman's fault, isn't it?  Lefevre's misogyny shining through again.

Beat me to it, I'm a big fan of Alaphilippe but he's a grown man for goodness' sake and Lefevre is a cockwomble. Carrying on in a long historic tradition, Helen caused the fall of Troy, Cleopatra destroyed Marc Anthony, right the way up to Yoko broke up the Beatles, if there's a woman involved, even peripherally, people like him will always know where to pin the blame.

Rendel Harris wrote:

Steve K wrote:

It's always the woman's fault, isn't it?  Lefevre's misogyny shining through again.

Beat me to it, I'm a big fan of Alaphilippe but he's a grown man for goodness' sake and Lefevre is a cockwomble. Carrying on in a long historic tradition, Helen caused the fall of Troy, Cleopatra destroyed Marc Anthony, right the way up to Yoko broke up the Beatles, if there's a woman involved, even peripherally, people like him will always know where to pin the blame.

I think you missed out the original - Eve getting Adam to eat the apple.

I've always liked apples. Never waited for a woman to offer me one.

Or maybe he knows them better than you do, and he has reason to believe the gentleman in question is not good at saying "no" to his lady.

john_smith wrote:

Or maybe he knows them better than you do, and he has reason to believe the gentleman in question is not good at saying "no" to his lady.

Or maybe he's a notorious misogynist, responsible for such gems as "The reason there is more sexual harassment these days is because more women go out drinking" and "I'm not going to add a female team to Quickstep, I'm not a welfare centre."

PS It's perfectly clear what Lefevre is up to as he has done this with multiple riders in the past, he is now putting all his faith in Remco and doesn't want to be distracted by having to support and particularly having to pay the wages of JA, so he starts sniping in the press until he pisses them off enough that they go elsewhere. It's his standard MO. I would bet a pound to a penny that there is no substance to his claim that JA has been partying too hard or that he is under the influence of his wife, it's just a way of insulting him in public in order to make him leave.