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news
Near Miss of the Day 524: “Taking primary' doesn't always work” – Driver close passes Surrey Hills cyclist riding downhill
Today's Near Miss of the Day video, in the words of road.cc reader Nick who was on the receiving end of a very close pass as he descended Staple Lane in the Surrey Hills, demonstrates that "'taking primary' doesn't always work."
"Having previously submitted footage for NMOTD 232 (yes, I did get a rear-camera for Xmas that year!) I’ve been fortunate to have ‘only’ had a couple of close-passes since - sadly, as with this clip, they were reported to Surrey Police who, like most forces these days, simply do not provide any feedback on if they’ve viewed a video or taken action on it. It’s been over 4 weeks since I reported this, so I feel it’s safe to share," Nick said.
"Anyway, I felt I should share this incident as it really does highlight that, sadly, ’taking primary’ doesn’t always work. To set the scene, I’m approaching the summit of Staple Lane in Surrey about to descend the hill towards the A246. There was a cyclist ahead of me, so to keep a safe distance from that rider I took the centre-line of the carriageway as I start to accelerate down the hill. As I’m descending the hill at speed, I’m largely concentrating on the control of my bike, so I was somewhat stunned that a motor vehicle overtook me at speed and extremely closely. Due to the wind noise I couldn’t hear their approach (had they politely ‘pipped’ I’d have moved across, as the road is quite wide at that point) - generally speaking, on a narrow country lane you don’t really want a car in front, as any on-coming traffic will make them stop and pull-over, thus forcing you to stop also, whereas if they aren’t in front you can usually pass oncoming traffic quite easily - this scenario can be really dangerous on a descent, as you’ll be going much faster, hence my preference to always take primary on such roads (it also improves your visibility to traffic from both directions.)
"Due to my speed down the hill (you will usually go well over 30mph+ on that hill) I was certainly not impeding the driver, nor was I expecting anyone to do anything so stupid - if I had veered off my line the driver would have almost certainly hit me and I would have been severely injured or killed," Nick added.
> Near Miss of the Day turns 100 - Why do we do the feature and what have we learnt from it?
Over the years road.cc has reported on literally hundreds of close passes and near misses involving badly driven vehicles from every corner of the country – so many, in fact, that we’ve decided to turn the phenomenon into a regular feature on the site. One day hopefully we will run out of close passes and near misses to report on, but until that happy day arrives, Near Miss of the Day will keep rolling on.
If you’ve caught on camera a close encounter of the uncomfortable kind with another road user that you’d like to share with the wider cycling community please send it to us at info [at] road.cc or send us a message via the road.cc Facebook page.
If the video is on YouTube, please send us a link, if not we can add any footage you supply to our YouTube channel as an unlisted video (so it won't show up on searches).
Please also let us know whether you contacted the police and if so what their reaction was, as well as the reaction of the vehicle operator if it was a bus, lorry or van with company markings etc.
> What to do if you capture a near miss or close pass (or worse) on camera while cycling
Simon joined road.cc as news editor in 2009 and is now the site’s community editor, acting as a link between the team producing the content and our readers. A law and languages graduate, published translator and former retail analyst, he has reported on issues as diverse as cycling-related court cases, anti-doping investigations, the latest developments in the bike industry and the sport’s biggest races. Now back in London full-time after 15 years living in Oxford and Cambridge, he loves cycling along the Thames but misses having his former riding buddy, Elodie the miniature schnauzer, in the basket in front of him.
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25 comments
I thought the primary position was the middle of the lane?
The Fiesta driver is guilty. Is that tailgate open?
As the rider who submitted this footage, it's interesting to see the difference in comments on the road.cc forum versus the facebook post! I certainly appreciate the generally supportive nature of the comments on the forum so far.
I''m not going to dox myself by responding to the comments on the facebook post, most of which appear to be from either non-cyclists or people that have not read the article to understand the context. However, to answer some of those comments (not that they are likely to see them) :
1) I didn't stop to help the other cyclists as there was clearly more than enough people dealing with their issue. If 3 people are out for a ride and none of them have the ability to fix whatever might arise between them (they seemed to be coping just fine) then they would have flagged either myself or the rider in front of me down. Bearing in mind COVID restrictions, I'd still have been wary of getting too close to them.
2) I appreciate that it might look like I was break-checking the on-coming motorist to avoid the pile of mud near the top of the hill (0:58) - but let's face it, if you know you're about to descend a very steep hill, would you want mud on your tires?
3) Staple Lane is pretty sketchy due to the right hand dog-leg at the bottom that hides oncoming traffic (2:35) and is also quite uneven on the left-hand side, so taking the lane is the preferred line. It's not really a 'proper' two-lane road either, due to the variations in width - at the point of overtake, sure, it's plenty wide enough, but further down it's too narrow for two vehicles to pass without both of them having to pull into the verge. I never known it to have lane markings either if that is a factor to it's classification (I'm not 100% sure what the Highway Code has to say about this type of road tbh.)
4) Yeah, I should have said good afternoon to the rider that I passed. My bad.
Dude, you did fine, the driver was a tool who had no business behind the wheel
I agree the pass was dangerous actually it was stupid but unfortunately stuff does happen. We have all had experiences like that and they are frightening.
However you say and do some things that no road user should be doing. First you say that you want to obstruct the road because nobody could want to go faster than you. Not for you to decide how fast the road should be travelled. Then you say on the fast bit that it takes all your concentration to ride the bicycle at that speed, so you lost situational awareness. That is how most pilots and car drivers get into accidents. Then you say that you don't want to slow down which might happen if you let another vehicle past you. I don't know if that is because you don't like slowing down or because you are trying to break your personal record for that journey or because you are cycling so fast that you are worried about stopping suddenly if you have to but it is not for you to stop others overtaking just because they might then delay you.
It could just be phrasing in which case I apologize but actually I suspect with the three elements that you mention it probably is not just unfortunate phrasing.
Cool, can't argue. Probably best stop there, the rest of your post is chatter
Erm ... yes it is.
I don't know this particular road, so am not commenting on this precise incident, but, as a general principle, if I am riding along a road which is not wide enough to accommodate someone overtaking me safely, then it is absolutely my imperative (acknowledged by the Highway Code) to decide how fast the road should be travelled by riding in the primary position to prevent dangerous overtaking.
The fact that someone wants to go faster than me does not impart on them an entitlement to overtake me when it is not safe to do so.
it could be just your phrasing of course ...
It is your right to travel at any speed you like. It is your right to adopt the primary position if you so desire. It is not your right to do so with the objective of obstructing other road users so they cannot pass you safely. It is sensible to adopt the Primary Position where road situation would make an overtake on the secondary position unsafe and where the Primary Position is the safest place for that road user. Even in this situation if he said he took the Primary Position for safety reasons that is fine. He didn't. He states I was riding too fast to maintain control and situational awareness, I didn't want someone overtaking me because it is a pain in the arse if they do so I made myself as wide as possible. Can you see the difference is not just what he does but his attitude which is putting himself in danger so he can go a little bit faster for a few seconds more.
Funnily enough I did something similar thoughtwise. I had a Transit pull out of a junction and come alongside me with the drivers mate screaming there's a bike beside me. And I didn't slow down because I didn't want to and so he stayed in the middle of the road for a bit and then pulled in front of me. I should have slowed down though. I would have if I had been driving not cycling. It made me think about my attitude on a bike and how I might be becoming a bit arrogant without meaning to.
Leaving aside your spending two lengthy paragraphs apparently arguing against points that I didn't make, because I thought I was very clear about taking primary to prevent unsafe overtaking, the Highway Code is also clear that it is for the bike rider to judge what is in the interests of their own safety, and therefore what conditions would constitute a safe/unsafe overtake.
The driver behind is not necessarily going to agree with your judgement (and you may even be objectively mistaken, being human and all that), but your making that judgement and acting on it does not require the agreement of other parties.
All true but not the reasons he gave for doing it. He even says above there is room for two cars where the overtake occurred but he was trying to stop anyone overtaking him no matter what.
I think you'll find that you can, if you don't think that the following vehicle can pass you safely...
As the rider in question, let me clear this up - I was adopting the primary position to prevent someone from overtaking, because it could result in an unsafe situation further down the road: I'm descending quickly on a road that I know gets much narrower further down the road, and I don't want to slam into the back of someone that's had to pull over due to on-coming traffic (which there was at 2:36, but thankfully well after the car has gone by)
At no point did I state that I was riding too fast to maintain control and situational awareness, merely that I was concentrating on maintaining control, as I know the road well. The driver overtaking me simply took me by surprise, as I wasn't anticipating the manouevre largely due to my positioning, but also because I couldn't hear them due to the wind noise.
Sure, I could/should have looked over my shoulder prior to descent (and I would have moved over) but considering my positioning, I'm very much relying on the road sense of any following traffic, which is to yield to the road user in front, as is the norm in all driving situations.
The pass was idiotic no question. You're still saying you are likely to be going too fast to control your machine. Slam into the back of someone that has to pull over. I'm sure you mean brake hard but if you do mean crash into then you are going too fast. Your attack is to be commended but you might want to temper it a little. I recognise this because I' ve seen it in myself and seriously it is not worth risking yourself for a few seconds less or a vmax never achieved before.
No, he's saying that he's going at a speed which might prevent him braking in time if someone else does something totally stupid, and hence he's taken a road position that prevents them getting past and doing something stupid at a point where he knows this could happen.
If everyone - motorists and cyclists - drove/rode at a speed where they could absolutely brake in time for every bit of unexpected driver/cyclist/pedestrian/squirrel behaviour, we'd all proceed at walking pace. Proceeding above the pace where you could brake in time for every single eventuality is not "going too fast to control your machine."
He knows the danger but would still ride too fast to stop if somene in front had to pull over for other traffic (that isn't stupid). You are being foolish to protect him, his attitude could lead to an avoidable accident. He has repeatedly stated it. I am not going to argue further.
Good, because your position is victim-blaming nonsense.
This is why Internet forums are a den of iniquity - I'm saying one thing and you think I'm saying something else
- you've obviously cleared that up by stating that ' lack of control' == 'slam into the back of someone', which is certainly one interpretation, which I can relate to.
That being said, having 'emergency stopped' and flat-skidded on my bike previously (disc brakes) it's not something I'd have any desire on repeating, especially downhill, hence my road positioning (which is the point that Rendel Harris also makes)
Manouvre was shit, however I don't know how fast the driver was coming up but i always glance ovr my shoulder when about to overtake another cyclist and on completion and / or just before descending a similar fast hill by me*. It seems the other cyclist did the latter as he shoulder checked on the crest (unless you called out). So I as surprised you didn't know the car was coming.
*Which I take on the centreline like you do so I have options if the road conditions are shit etc.
The explanation that you were concentrating on a safe descent and didnt hear the car behind explains fully the situation. I agree, i would want a car in that situation to beep the horn to let me know they are there and then i could safely move left at an appropriate place. The over-taking manouevre was very poor and very dangerous driving.
If you leave enough room for a Nissan Micra to overtake safely then an SUV will squeeze through --- If you leave enough room for an SUV then a Transit will come through --- If you leave enough room for a Transit then ... --- etc, etc
Basically what we already know. We are at the mercy of other road users
Taking Prime Position does at least give you some room to take a dive on your left.
Certainly an unsafe pass and I can understand the rider wanting to block a pass on a fast stretch of road. Given the road was wide enough I think I'd have left them space to overtake. Positioning over to the left would have allowed the car to give 1.5m (though they may not have given it)
On the video you see the cyclists line change a little from the left to the centre, it's a quick downhill and the road surface probably changes a lot. Also if he's going downhill at 30mph why would a car want to pass to then block the road as soon as a vehicle is coming the other way?
It looks as though the driver ploughs through an imaginary gap without any change in speed, if the car had have decelerated and shifted down etc. the rider would be more aware of its presence.
Regardless of the position of the bike, the driver took the action of endangering the life of the cyclist to save a few seconds in the knowledge that they would be 100% safe. Selfish and shameful!
Quite, the driver pulled a dangerous manoeuvre. It cannot be justified by a third party opinion about the rider's position. That may be debated on its own merits, but does not give a free pass to dangerous driving.
Yup, Because it would have been great to encounter road debris or a minor flood along the side of the road while downhilling at speed...
The rider was overtaking another at 1:57. During following manoeuvre (to move back toward the left of the lane after progressing enough to ensure that they weren't cutting the other rider up), the driver forced their way past. This is at 2:04, so a mere 7 seconds later.
The driver had full view of what was happening and still chose to force their way past. There was little that the rider could do to prevent or mitigate this.