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TECH NEWS
Just in: Kinesis Tripster ATR
Next up on the busy testing schedule here at road.cc is the Kinesis Tripster ATR, a disc-specific titanium frameset from the people that brought you the Gran Fondo titanium, the Gran Fondo SC, the Racelite TK3, the Crosslight 5T… cracking bikes one and all. So the bar is set pretty high for this one.
Custom drawn from 3Al/2.5V Titanium, the Tripster ATR is a fine looking thing. “Sumptuous” and “tactile” were the adjectives used by interested onlookers to describe it on the trip to the cycle circuit to take the pics. And it really is a very well considered piece of work. ATR stands for Adventure-Tour-Race and the idea is to provide a lightweight, comfortable, disc-specific frameset for anyone that wants to push the boundaries of what road riding can be. You won’t be racing it at your local crit, but you might consider the Transcontinental. That sort of racing. Actually, that’d tick all three boxes.
There’s lots of good detailing on the frame but the most obvious place to start is the tapered head tube. It’s machined from a solid billet of titanium to get that concave profile, and the 1.5” rear bearing race mates up with the all-carbon fork to give what should be a nice stiff front end. The head badge is machined into the surface of the tube, rather than being stuck on top. It’s very nicely done.
The geometry is fairly relaxed. on a 57cm frame you’re getting am 18.5cm head tube and a 57cm effective top tube; the head angle is 70.5° and the fork is longer to accommodate bigger tyres, so that lifts the front end too. The bottom bracket is nice and low (7.5cm drop from the axles) to aid stability. All this adds up to a reasonably upright position, for a road bike. It’s not a tourer, more like the relaxed end of sportive geometry. Audax, if you like. The top tube is gently sloping and the main triangle is fairly classic-looking, save for the funky head tube: round top tube and seatstays and a bi-ovalised downtube (tall at the head tube and flat at the bottom bracket) to better cope with the stresses at those points.
at the back the chainstays and seatstays both have an hourglass curve. At the chainstays it’s to allow for a big tyre while maintaining heel clearance, and for the seatstays it’s to improve vertical compliance for comfort on longer rides.
The disc brake mount is a skeletal titanium affair and sits on the back of the seatstay, traditional style. We spoke to Dom at Kinesis about why it’s there, rather than inboard like most road discs; he told us that the inboard disc, coupled with the need to accommodate big tyres, made it difficult to site the disc calliper there without getting issues with heel clearance. Outside the triangle that’s not an issue, but fitting mudguards might be; helpfully Kinesis have a mount available that fits to the disc mount on top of the brake, and eliminates those issues.
The ATR isn’t designed as a full-on touring bike and as such doesn’t have double eyelets on the rear dopout, but the extra widget will give you two mounting points if you need them.
Build quality looks to be excellent. The welds are extremely neat, and the finish of the frame is beautiful, with under-down-tube and inside-fork-leg decals that manage to be both bold and unobtrusive at the same time. Good job.
We’ve currently got a Di2 hydraulic disc groupset on test that’s been on a Culprit frameset, so that’s been the basis of this build. The frame doesn’t have internal cable routing but with Shimano’s stick-on conduit down the bottom of the downtube, and an external battery, it’s still possible to make it look pretty neat. For now we’ve got Shimano’s RX31 wheels fitted, although we have some lighter Novatec hoops coming in that will probably find their way onto the bike at some point.
The ATR has room for up to 45mm tyres (or 40mm with mudguards) but we’ve plumped for a very conservative 30mm, the Challenge Strada Bianca. The seatpost is a Spin Titanium unit, and that’s a Selle San Marco Aspide saddle that needs testing sitting on top.
At the front the stem and bars are both Zipp Service Course SL alloy, with Cinelli gel cork tape. The frameset weighs 1,620g for the 60cm which is about the same as a Salsa Colossal (frame a bit lighter, fork a bit heavier). All in the build weighs 9.3kg (20.5lb) without pedals. The frameset retails for £1,499.
Dave is a founding father of road.cc, having previously worked on Cycling Plus and What Mountain Bike magazines back in the day. He also writes about e-bikes for our sister publication ebiketips. He's won three mountain bike bog snorkelling World Championships, and races at the back of the third cats.
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48 comments
Nice frame, but seriously, for £1,499 I would want something custom built..
Oh look. More Kinesis / Road cc love-ins.
This frame is the basis of my current dream bike build. One day maybe.
Dom, I've just ordered a Morvelo hoodie, if someone could stick an ATR frame with it, it would much appreciated
Feel free
I hope it is just the photo, it looks really awkward... poorly proportioned or unbalanced... or something.
Look here > http://www.kinesisbikes.co.uk/bikes/decade/tripster-atr
"helpfully Kinesis have a mount available that fits to the disc mount on top of the brake, and eliminates those issues."
Methinks a bit of thin bent metal supporting ~30kg of panniers won't get you to Calais, let alone the Karakoram highway.
It's 1.5mm stainless steel and it's for the mudguard stay. The pannier rack is bolted to the welded eyelets on the frame.
Thanks Dom. So basically you've shifted the guard mount 2-3" up and back - which on a 700c guard would then require cutting back of the LHS stays to fit tidily/not be a hazard. Plus unless you're running narrow hydraulic calipers, rules out a sturdy rack carrying lots of weight. I don't buy that *any* adapter will work long-term under touring loads - hell, you have enough problems with frame fittings/loctite/nylock nuts etc etc without adding another point of flex/leverage.
(noted Dave's comment above re racks being do-able in certain combos, along with others saying the catch heels on fat chainstay calipers)
An adapter for the guard, and (maybe) an adapter for the rack - methinks 2015's ATR would best be suited following the inboard mount crowd...I'm probably not your typical customer, but I'm looking for 'one bike to rule them all' early next year, and that mounting position rules out the ATR. Which is a real pity because I dig your design ethos - I've ridden a TK3 and loved it.
Don't you always have to get the dremel out for the mudguard stays? I did, with sks guards on a normal road frame. Mine are slotted onto same bolts as the rack (would be my approach with the ATR too, I think) and the dremel chopped 2 inches off the mudguard stays (saving 30g also!).
Absolutely. Stays are hardly ever the right length and are normally trimmed.
Oh believe me *I know*... http://gateauvelo.blogspot.co.uk/2013/03/sks-race-blade-long-and-650c-wh...
it's difficult to see how you'd crash this bike with enough force to render the internal head tube bearing seats unusable without that being the very least of your worries
I have to say, I'm a bit disappointed by the lack of internal routing for the Di2.
For a big mile-muncher, weather resilience has to be built in. I run an external Di2 at the moment, but I think for a frameset upgrade i'd only really be looking at internally routed options.
Oh, and can we please have some stack/reach measurements?
That Chris King article was written over a decade ago, before they'd got anything that would fit a bike with an integrated headset to market. Surprise surprise, since then they've shut up about it.
Very, very nice. Kinesis really do seem to do some very well-thought out bikes.
Thanks : ]
This is VERY tempting... the bike I'd be most likely to buy right now is just this sort of all-purpose road bike.
Nice frame, but given a Ti frame can be a "lifetime" investment, I'm disappointed in the choice of an integrated headset. Chris King (who should know) describes them as disposable bits that destroy frames.
Considering how stiff a billet-machined headtube must be, why not just go with a smaller traditional headset? I think integrated headsets are fine on disposable bikes, but if you are aiming a bike at "ATR" I would think a more traditional headset would be a better choice.
They stuck with a traditional BB - a surprise given the "fashion" choice for headset.
Tech is here
http://www.kinesisbikes.co.uk/technical/decade/tripster-atr
Chris King
http://chrisking.com/files/pdfs/Int20HeadsetsExplained.pdf
In our experience the integrated h.set is not a 'frame destroyer'. I've used them in many frames, CX, winter, MTB and road over nearly 15 years of frame design and can't ever recall a warranty case concerning head tube damage. [Integrated h.sets are also super easy to replace, no press tools required].
The fork choice is far from a 'fashion' choice, we could have used a more traditional fork but the taper steerer, monocoque carbon fork is lighter, stronger and gives a better ride quality than the older style, alloy crown 1-1/8" type. No point in a stiff head tube area coupled to a flexy fork.
The large lower bearing with the steerer tapering to 1.5" really adds strength and response, and the taper HT means we've got a nice large weld area.
So, the fork choice is based purely on performance to match the intended use of the frame.
No Kinesis UK frame design is ever driven by fashion, the brand is driven by responding to and exploring emerging riding styles and rider requirements and using new components and technology in a considered way.
Threaded BB is used because just about every bike shop across the world will have access to the components and tools to replace one.
Hope this helps to explain some of the thinking behind the ATR.
Thanks for that - the link is still active on the Chris King site, so if (as another comment suggests) it's no longer the case, I would have thought it would be removed or updated. I understand Chris King is a business, but it's often cited as being a reference, so who to believe?
I would suggest that "driven by responding to and exploring emerging riding styles and rider requirements" is sort-of making my point. Where some manufacturers seem to stick with tried-and-true (maybe to a fault) there is (what I call) a "fashion" market for "emerging styles". I've seen a lot come and go over the years, and as you point out, there's nothing wrong with the British BB standard - but look at what's on offer now (with similar rationalisation). Sometimes different is better - sometimes it's just different
Materials and component development helps drive and enhance product design in many different area's, bike design is no different. Using the advances in a considered way and where they make sense from a performance point of view is key IMO. If a wide press-fit BB makes loads of sense on one frame, it may not make sense on another. Same goes for taper HT or slack HA or 650b wheels.
'Fashion' by it's very nature comes and goes, but there's no harm in staying at the sharp end and using the advances in technology that are generated by progression. 'Tried and Tested' is good, but I'm not into 'traditional' or 'backward looking'.
Evolve or Die.
Right I'm off to ride my MTB [Ti, 650b, PF30 BB, Taper HT, Internal routing, 142x12 rear, direct mount rear mech...]
Nice, very nice. In fact that's the nicest looking bike I've seen in a long time.
And re: zip ties - kudos to them for going for zip ties!
They are an excellent lightweight solution, which lets you have full outer cables on the whole bike. Best of all, if you leave them a click or two loose, then as you turn the bars the cable can slide freely and bend gracefully, rather than sharp twists and turns. I wish more bikes did it this way!
(Don't get me started on internal cable routing - as someone who had to recable one recently - hopefully never again).
Apologies, this addictive editing function sure throws the order of the posts!
definitely you can fit a rack, and the bike's designed to take one. with hydraulic callipers (and some others, eg TRP Spyre & Hy/Rd) you could probably fit any rack you fancied. With others that stick out more, you might need to go for a disc-specific rack
UGLY!
How much does the frameset weigh?
I quite fancy one of these, but I want to know if it's heavier than the Equilbrium Ti or the Salsa Colossal
1,620g for the 60cm. frame and fork is about the same as the salsa (frame a bit lighter, fork a bit heavier)
Pretty sure the 1620g is for the frame only, especially on a 60cm.
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