CTC urges cyclists to write to Eurostar over bike policy change revealed by road.cc

Quite, I doubt Eurostar have ever allowed handcycles, recumbents, tandems etc- as I understand it the cycle capacity was of the "hang up by the front wheel" type (as found also on many domestic trains).

Eurotunnel will carry tandems and trailers, and so are likely to carry other "non-standard" bikes- the site doesn't say so, but you have to phone to book anyway. You do, for that, have to get yourself to Folkestone, but that's no different really to getting yourself to a ferry port

Just to clarify, Eurotunnel (which carries cars) is quite seperate to Eurostar which carries foot passengers, and until this change, bicycles. They may never have carried oversize bikes such as tandems. (As a tandem owner I know that virtually no train operators will carry them).

Here's my recent correspondence. I have to say, seeing as 7,300 people wrote to them about this, they are responding quickly to emails. I answered the stock response that DaveE128 posted, as follows:

Hello, and thank you for your quick response.

I am partly reassured that you say you will provide a padded bike box. Will the box be available if I just turn up or does it have to be reserved or ordered in some way?

Also, you say that staff are trained -- will they dismantle and re-assemble bikes for customers who are not able to do so for themselves, especially disabled ones?

Thank you.

Andrew Rowland

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On 20.10.2015 12:39, Traveller Care wrote:

Dear Mr Rowland,

Thank you for your response.

Boxes need to be booked in advance. You can turn [up] on the day but we cannot guarantee availability if you haven't reserved a box ahead of travel.

Travellers are responsible for dismantling their own bikes with staff at hand to assist.

Kind regards,

Eurostar Traveller Care

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Hello again,

Thank you for that clarification. It is highly discriminatory towards disabled cyclists if they are expected to dismantle their machines themselves, which could include handcycles, wheelchair conversions, tandems etc. It is also discriminatory toward all cyclists that you do not expect motorists to dismantle their vehicles before you will carry them. What would the reaction of the motoring public be, I wonder, if they had to remove their wheels themselves 'with staff at hand to assist'?

I don't think you have any idea how difficult this would be even for technically competent cyclists. If I am on holiday with my tourer, it has a rear rack, panniers and mudguards. I presume they would all have to come off. I changed my mudguards last year and it was a major operation. I understand that if the bike has hydraulic disc brakes, removing the wheel is tricky and getting it all set up again afterwards is very fiddly. What you are proposing is a good afternoon's work by a fairly competent mechanic, not something that should be entered into mid-journey under time constraints. And why should cyclists be expected to have a skill set that you do not expect of your other customers? I know many keen cyclists who leave all their maintenance to the local bike shop (or in my wife's case, her husband) and no-one wants to start their holiday covered in grease, which would be inevitable.

Furthermore, some itineraries require a dash across Paris or London to catch a connection. This ridiculous requirement would involve very significant delays while the bike is reassembled.

I have two further questions.

1. According to press reports, Eurostar originally specified a maximum box size that was smaller than most existing boxes. One website said it had never tested one that small. Since it is quite impossible to carry a box on a bike that is large enough to put the bicycle into, will you have boxes available that are large enough to accommodate laden tourers, tandems, recumbents, hand cycles etc?

2. If one of your staff assists a passenger and the brakes are not left properly adjusted so that the passenger suffers injury, would Eurostar accept liability?

Thank you.

Andrew Rowland

If I was using Eurostar (and I was hoping to) then there is a good chance I would be on the touring bike with camping gear so it would be interesting to see how that would fit the box. Racks and mudguards removed? What a pain! Even worse with the BobYak.

They say wheels must be removed, but give no details regarding the bike box, is the bike frame held securely in the box or does it sit on its mudguards and derailleur?

Whichever, it's all good news for the ferries.

What if you have to do one of those mad dashes across Paris? By the time you have reassembled your bike...

And what about disabled riders, riders of recumbents that don't fit their box? If the box they provide 'to customers who would rather not travel with one' ('rather not'? How about 'can't carry a box on a bike that is large enough to put the bike in'?) is the same size as the original size restriction, now lifted, aren't you stuffed anyway?

The stock response from Eurostar that's gone out is pretty much "Silly cyclists, we're doing this for your own good".

Remember under their T&Cs that your bike might not make it on the same train as you. It's guarenteed to reach the same city as you within 24hrs...

I've got the following stock response from Eurostar:

Good afternoon,

Eurostar Traveller Care 

Here's what I've sent in reply:

Dear Eurostar,

Thank you for your reply. I don't think you quite understand why I would be using Eurostar to carry a bike. I would want to use the bike at both ends of my train journey. Insisting that I box it is completely impractical and will prevent me travelling with Eurostar with my bike. Besides, I find it very hard to believe that your staff are trained cycle mechanics that are competent to assist anyone with disassembling and reassembling their bike safely into and out of your unknown-size bike box. In fact I don't even know whether my bike will fit into your (presumably tiny - from recent media reports) box without taking a hacksaw to the frame!
I thought perhaps the following parody might help you understand the issue from a cyclist's point of view. (After all, I understand that you failed to consult any major cycling organisation like the CTC before introducing this change!) And yes, I do understand the difference between Eurostar and Eurotunnel!

I would first like to reassure you Eurotunnel's vehicle policy has been designed to use the space on our trains more flexibly for the benefit of all customers, including car drivers.

As you correctly point out, cars will now need to have their wheels, windscreen wipers and luggage removed and fully wrapped in a tarpaulin. Any-coloured car tarpaulins will be accepted, and Eurotunnel will happily provide a single 180cm x 180cm groundsheet  to customers who would rather not travel with one. Please also rest assured that our staff are trained to remove car luggage, windscreen wipers and wheels and are ready to assist to ensure it is a seamless experience for our passengers.

When packaged in this way, it means that we can look at carrying more motor vehicles than before depending on the demand from passengers, which I’m sure you will agree is good news for the driving community.

I hope this will help clarify the situation, and reassure you that our motor vehicle driving customers continue to be important to us.

I can only assume that you are trying to reduce the number of cyclists using Eurostar. If you were not, you would surely have consulted organisations like the CTC to look at how to deal with the issue in a way that really is good news for the cycling community. If this is the aim, Eurostar ought to be ashamed.
If you are getting too many bikes to fit on your trains, perhaps you should just charge slightly more for the bikes and explain why you're doing it? Or better yet, increase your bike space.

Kind regards,

Ignoring that comment above and moving on...

I did the CTC thing and got an email back from Eurostar, and they seemed to have softened stance a little to 'a bike box of any size.' And they will supply one.

I suspect that even if they go ahead with this it will now be, in the very least, really well run. Well, we can hope!

Jeesuuz,

they supply you the box, it gets more in the train, they're not charging for it, your bike may(?) be better protected.
How were they stored before? just chucked in the aisle in everyone else's way or stowed by the stewards without any protection?

Careful not to confuse Eurostar with Eurotunnel. You can still take a bike with relative ease via Eurotunnel from Folkestone.

Really not sure how big a deal this is. I wouldn't take a bike to Paris or vice versa, as both cities have widespread cycle hire which is many times easier. If you're planning to go further on via the TGV for a cycling holiday, a protective bike bag probably wouldn't be that bad an idea.

Even though the ferries are less convenient, I'll just use these in future, simple really. Of course Eurostar are just relying on people grumbling but not moving their business.

Just like any business, they'll sponsor something like the Ashden Awards for Sustainable Travel because of the political kudos it gives them, alongside the ability to point at it and say "look, we're good guys and we care!", all the while not actually giving a damn about cyclists, cycling, or sustainable travel that doesn't involve their shareholders seeing a profit.

Maybe Eurotunnel will soon require drivers to remove the wheels and doors from their cars, and cover them in a tarpaulin before driving onto their trains?

Just seen the email from CTC and have now sent the email to Eurostar. Only takes a few seconds.