Bike sales predicted to drop in 2020 despite lock down bike sales boom

I don't know what you would be, but maybe rethink the words you use to describe it.

OK Karen!!

Oh my, a word I don't like...............clutches pearls & runs for safe space............send for the "Thought Police"!!

Make him kneel imediately & apologise.

mickb wrote:

OK Karen!!

Oh my, a word I don't like...............clutches pearls & runs for safe space............send for the "Thought Police"!!

Make him kneel imediately & apologise.

wow, what a jerk.

And that's your first post...

Who'd have thought that a word that insults a whole ethnic group and disparages a genetic condition shouldn't be used that way? It's not 'Thought Police' but just common decency. Maybe you're just an arsehole though?

I remember Ming being in charge of mongs? That was in 1981 though.

In this context, I think "mong" doesn't refer to the people of Mongo, loyal subjects of Emperor Ming the Merciless (also a problematic racial stereotype, but that is another matter).

In this context, I think "mong" is an abbreviation for "mongoloid", originally referring to people with Downs Syndrome (cos they look just like people from Mongolia, geddit?) and then later it became used as a more general term for anyone considered to have learning and/or developmental problems.

It is not an expression that anyone should be using nowadays, IMO.

"IMO" is indeed the key to this.

And therein lies the problem! It is merely each of your opinions which lead you to post as you do. What makes your opinions right & another's wrong? Sadly, there is a degree of self aggrandisement in your attitudes. Some would cruelly say "group smugness". (I could be tempted to go that far but will resist)

You also miss my point entirely as you rush to virtue signal to each other & one of you even labels me a "jerk" & another an "arsehole". Powerful critical analysis I have to admit. Amusingly, though, pretty much what I expected (no..I have to confess - "hoped for" - bored by weeks of lockdown as I am now). Might be my first post but I have read plenty of comments on here over the years so know the general tenor.

A suggestion; read "The Madness of Crowds" & have a little think before you get sucked into band waggons so easily in the future.

My point: Somebody took the trouble to post an opinion & yet rather than comment on the substance of the content the OP is immediately criticised for the use of one word as if this reveals a deep, ugly truth about his/her character & colours any opinion they may hold. Four letters arranged in a particular order which, in your opinions, will cause offence not just to you & your fellow "professional offence takers" but to the groups you choose, unelected, to speak on behalf of (wow!! - even an entire ethnic group, I see!).

I would, however, respectfully point out that banning words is a first small step along the path to burning books! History shows that those who sanction & condone it are always convinced it's for the best (well the useful idiots are led to see it that way).

I would also contend that only when a word is surrendered by good & decent people to those who want to use it maliciously does it gain any real power to hurt. If you ignore it, or better still, use it without malintent the word loses any power to do bad things. We once used to know this fact as a nation & even taught it to our children.

Further to the comments above; judging people for "wrong speak" is exactly what the thought police aided by their snitches do in "1984". "Arsehole" or not, I would contend (as a long time scholar of Eric Arthur Blair), that it is a legitimate literary comparison in this case. I note that no evidence is provided for the assertion otherwise which is posted above. Sadly it seems merely contradicting an opinion counts as negating its validity these days. You seemingly just need enough people to repeat that it isn't true & the matter is settled without evidential debate!

I am unsure that any of this will make the slightest difference to your ingrained, very simplistic, woke attitudes but one can but hope it makes you think a little. It's also given my legs chance to recover from a savage turbo session whilst providing me with a little distraction on a rather wet evening.

Big question is can you resist not allowing me the last word?

mickb wrote:

You also miss my point entirely as you rush to virtue signal to each other & one of you even labels me a "jerk" & another an "arsehole".

You didn't make any points. You didn't attempt to engage with the issue at all. You just attempted to undermine and dismiss it by trying to make an unjustified and insulting characterisation of the person raising it. It's a bit rich for you then to complain about personal abuse (even if I wouldn't personally have chosen to use that language).

mickb wrote:

the OP is immediately criticised for the use of one word as if this reveals a deep, ugly truth about his/her character

No-one did that. I would give them the benefit of the doubt and assume they weren't aware of the connotations of the term. Hence the link explaining why it's problematic.

mickb wrote:

Big question is can you resist not allowing me the last word?

A bigger question is why you think you should be entitled to the last word.

Fuck off, Mick. Nobody cares enough about what you think to read a whole screen of your drivel.

Personally, I don't think that RoubaixCube intended any offense by using that specific word and mdavidford implied that it was an accidental use of a word that carries a lot of baggage. I'm sure that I've used it in the past without knowing that is was offensive (probably quite a while ago, though).

The reason that I called you an arsehole was that you were defending the use of a word that is insultingly racist. I can't really think of any examples where replacing that word with something like 'fool' or 'idiot' doesn't improve the sentence. It's not so much about controlling language as recognising that language changes and as society changes, we become more aware of past mistakes that should be kept in the past.

As to the '1984' comparison, in general I'd agree that control of language can exert control over thinking. However, I don't see how suppressing a thoughtlessly racist word (which entered the language based on mis-understanding the nature of Down's syndrome) can negatively affect people's thought patterns. There's plenty of other words which express racist sentiments with much greater clarity and precision.

I appreciate the trolling attempt (successful?) but I do find your condescending tone to be unnecessary and it detracts from what you're saying.

Hawkinspeter, 

Whilst I agree that the term is insulting, and can upset many people, is it racist? I'm not really sure. You mention the word used based on mis-understanding the nature of Downs syndrome, but people with Downs syndrome are not a race, or are they? In these politically correct sensitive times, I do think that the word racist is much abused, misunderstood and mis-used, it is also used to shut down discussions. 

Even if used to describe the Mongoloids, is it not the same as describing British as Brits, Scottish as Scots? If so, then it is also racist to use the words 'Brits, Scots'.

I don't know, maybe I am wrong. But I am not defending the use of it in the above post. It is a little crass.

The term 'Mongoloid' is itself racist (i.e. referring to a 'race' of people) and there's a good page on it here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mongoloid

(Note that it's usage is considered outdated and possibly offensive)

'Brits' and 'Scots' refer to a geographical grouping of people as well as being an ethnic group (though not a 'race'). You can become Scottish by living in Scotland and you can also remain Scottish by being born there and then living elsewhere. Similarly, 'Mongolian' is not a racist term, but an ethnic and geographical group.

And far from shutting down discussion, this choice of word has completely taken over the discussion and RoubaixCube's original point has been largely ignored. (Though the pot was stirred by mickb)

Careful biker phil. This is far too close to sensible reasoned analysis. Your post also requires a full reading & some folk admit they don't get past the first sentence!

BTW your points make perfect sense but unfortunately racism refers to anything the social justice warriors like nowadays.

Brave key board warriors like srchar can be on your case in an instant & as he/she admits, they don't even need to read your full post to know you are evil & order you to F off from their presence.

BTW far from complaining about personal abuse (as someone above states) I think you will find that I was relishing it & pointing it up as an indication of the intellectual level from which many of the comments were eminating. Telling someone to F off or calling them a nasty name is generally a final admission that you have no reasoned argument to offer.

mdavidford I am sure that RoubaixCube will be eternally grateful for the education you have kindly provided so that he/she will no longer accidently misuse the english language. When you are as lacking in social graces as we, it's always a pleasure to get input from those who are far wiser. Oh wait a minute...... I thought that it was obvious that I most definitely did not want the last word yet I now see that one person appears to actually think that I did.......and it was you.

At least I know the answer to that "big question". No, you lot couldn't resist. Have to admit (in a no doubt condescending way) I already knew it would be worth checking back.

Thanks for the entertainment. However, what a deluded world we live in when the belief that eliminating a few words will help shape people's inner feelings. Even the fictional characters of the thought police knew you had to go further than just a "newspeak" dictionary. Guess what......those who want to hurt people's feelings will just invent a new word or failing any words use a gesture!

The only solution is room 101. When you truly believe that 2+2=5 then you are cured.

It's been a blast but I am bored now! Shallow arguments with little prospect of witty clever responses. Just pedantic lecturing or simplistic abuse. Not even any comments about OP's original points about the likely impact of Covid on the bike industry in 2021.

mickb - do you have any opinion on the matter of bicycle sales or are you just here to stoke the culture wars? I've read back and I don't think you've had anything to say, just your three posts on here, none of which reference bikes?

The Mick is dead. Long live the Genghis. (............before you start, please note that this is not intended as a racist slur on Irish people) Simply following the vogue for self identifcation & choosing to do so with a noble, much maligned warrior race......sure you will have fun thinking of suitable pronouns. No real opinion on 2021 bike sales other than I agree that parting with money without receiving goods in a reasonable time frame is not a good idea. If the OP's attitude is replicated enough it may lead to a break down in some business models.

I am really gone from here now. Sad, I know!