Hit-and-run driver who killed motorcyclist jailed for 24 years

You seem keen to portray yourself as someone doing a public good.

An anti EU username is equivalent to illegal parking/driving in the examples you've given.

Opinions you disagree with are the equivalent of actual crimes...

We (correctly) see them as actual crimes, along with close passing, but in these instances enforcement is so thin, penalties so light that there is little comeback or deterrent. And here's the kicker - drivers no longer see what they are doing as wrong - Mikey somehow becomes the controversial figure, the "grass", the Bad Guy.  Why can't he leave them alone? 

nototheEU and his kin has brought great harm on this country that is set only to continue.  When asked, he cannot identify any benefits - leastways, not to the man in the street: you can bet that someone is benefitting - it's little more than a a perception or a thing he fancied doing, no wider interests feature.

You might think that after 20 years he might have been able to come up with better. I've only been at it for about three myself, and I've never managed to get past "people have got too much of everything these days" and "the freedom to do whatever you want" as attempts at justification.  Brexit didn't invent Covid and it didn't invade Ukraine, but it's not helping us get through them.

Anyway, apparently, it's all the implementation's fault, so let's see where that leads us. 

The ironic thing is that you can't see the huge harm that you're doing.

When the losing side refuses to accept a democratic result democracy itself is damaged.

When one side starts demonising and 'othering' the opposition then democracy is damaged.

You might believe that Brexit has caused great harm. That doesn't justify hounding any and all Brexit supporters wherever you might find them.

Leave or Remain, we're all just people who voted for what we thought was best.

Accepting that others see the world differently to you and vote accordingly is a vital part of living in a democratic society. For all its flaws it's still the least bad system we've got.

The ironic thing is that you can't see the huge harm that you're doing

What nonsense! Huge harm?! This is a pro-cycling website seen by a few people and 'doing huge harm' with it is not possible. The huge harm was committed by the people harking back to the Days of Empire and 'going it alone'- if you don't agree, then you're entitled to say so.

I agree that one person refusing to accept a democratic result and demonising those who voted differently is not hugely harmful.

However once that attitude becomes embedded in a large number of people it begins to erode the very fabric of democracy.

You is both singular and plural.

Rich_cb wrote:

The ironic thing is that you can't see the huge harm that you're doing. When the losing side refuses to accept a democratic result democracy itself is damaged.

Niche bike website here... But is this "the election was stolen" combined with all kinds of dubious and frankly illegal chicanery?   I don't support constantly sniping at "the other side" but if someone wants to immediately campaign for changing things in the opposite direction what could be more in keeping with UK democracy *sigh*?

Not that I'm saying our "first one way, then the other" system is great - I'm also with Winston Churchill on that.

I have no problem with people campaigning for whatever they want.

If people want to rejoin let them get a majority in the HoC, call a referendum and win it.

There are some parallels between the language used by Remain supporters in the aftermath of the referendum and the language of Trump but thankfully no attempts at armed insurrection by Lord Adonis and co!

Rich_cb wrote:

There are some parallels between the language used by Remain supporters in the aftermath of the referendum and the language of Trump but thankfully no attempts at armed insurrection by Lord Adonis and co!

"Language of Trump"? Now that's insulting!

Maybe things would be different if they hadn't taken our guns...

hawkinspeter wrote:

Maybe things would be different if they hadn't taken our guns...

Let me know when the revolution is coming, I'll need time to ready the trebuchet and oil the longbow. 

For more of the language of Trump see here.  Then tweet till the Covfefe come home.

Hands off our gnus!

David9694 wrote:

nototheEU and his kin has brought great harm on this country that is set only to continue.  When asked, he cannot identify any benefits - leastways, not to the man in the street: you can bet that someone is benefitting - it's little more than a a perception or a thing he fancied doing, no wider interests feature.

Well - I'd still say "too early to say".  The whole point about being more independent as I understand it is that you are free to do things differently - not that you're necessarily immediately better off.  Again - not a Brexiteer myself - partly because I suspected our politicians would immediately use this freedom to start reversing policies which provided a certain level of protection for people and environment.

It certainly has been jam tomorrow for some and cynical self-interest.  But they were precisely those who'd be having their cake and eating it anyway.  The rich and powerful are always going to have it easier - at least until HP gets the revolution going.  It certainly wasn't jam tomorrow for many - but did they really believe that?  Or did they feel that those promises might not be true but there were other things they felt were more important?

David9694 wrote:

Brexit didn't invent Covid and it didn't invade Ukraine, but it's not helping us get through them.

But are you saying that NototheEU or ("his kin") are responsible for either of those things?  If not then the Brexit bit isn't really relevant - unless you're saying we could have forseen these things and that they'd necessarily affect us worse if we weren't in the EU?

I hear your argument about the UK being "less liberal" / "more angry" and this playing out in various different ways.  I'm not sure this is connected with the whole leaving the EU thing (see this article about the swings in public opinion over the last decades).  But then I've not been motivated to dig through detail on this.  I'm also unsure this is a big factor in road danger - there are lots of possible variables here.

chrisonatrike wrote:

The rich and powerful are always going to have it easier - at least until HP gets the revolution going.

Look, have you got any idea how hard it is to seed an insurrection using just squirrel pictures?

I was a little bit confused by all the FBPE, I also sounded out NOtotheEU as like HP I falsely suspected a troll. I don't think the football-supporter political stuff (shouting for your favourite colour) is informative or amusing. (By contrast some of the trolling bizarreness and great put-downs were memorable).

So I'm all for following the political money/influence. If you wanna wear your affiliations in your username fine (not for me but I'll ignore it) but political Punch and Judy comment threads are not my thing.

I'm sure I wouldn't share politics with some here but I have shared some interesting discussions about cycling and transport in general with them and found them thoughtful. Each to their own triggers...