Jeremy Vine's cycle lane near miss as empty bin chucked across London bike lane; Tributes to Davide Rebellin; Tour de France ditches Paris final stage, Nice finale rumoured; Remco signs up for the Giro; Cycling advent calendars + more on the live blog

Yeah - Vine's bit Marmite for me too.  He's often correct of course ... but either he or others sometimes make a bit more story out of it.  I think this one is mostly "bin man doing routine task not taking sufficient care with it" story.  Obviously didn't look where he was sending the bin.  That's not good of course, but likely just on autopilot and "it's not busy here" and didn't think any further.

Only additional thing to do might be to remind refuse collectors about cycle lanes and that cyclists could be moving considerably faster than pedestrians!

The large point to note is there's a contribution from this still being a UK cycle lane e.g. visually just another part of the "road" - no kerb, no separation, no change in colour...

Personally I'd note this for the next "why we still need better infra than this even though it's a wide lane for the UK" discussion.  Then put it down to experience.  It seems that the cyclist was sensibly being cautious and that paid off.

As a presenter I cannot abide Vine, he is the worse form of shock jock with no discernible journalistic talent or integrity, his radio show is a dreadful exercise is button pushing and shouting people down. Sadly this often bleeds into his cycling advocacy and detracts from when he does raise genuine issues. His recent video on High Street Ken with a taxi was an embaressment of him refusing to move back to the now clear LH lane to try and make a point.

Your likely right the worker was on autopilot and Vine saying it was his morning commute as well as it being dark, I would guess very early hours. Though more care really should have been taken.

I cycle this route myself on my homeward commute back to Charing Cross and it isn't anywhere near as bad as you think. Traffic is one way and as can be seen traffic signals on the cycle lane (although probably just Vine and myself who bother to actually stop). The biggest hazard later in the day is pedesrrians not paying any attention and walking blindly into the lane, as well as parked cycles in the lane Further up you hit Hammersmith roundabout and in the last few months a segreated and signalled lane has been added around the top going West to East, which is a godsend. Be nice if they did something the other way, as the roundabout is not nice to cycle round, but I am not sure how feasible that would be.

Adam Sutton wrote:

... The biggest hazard later in the day is pedesrrians not paying any attention and walking blindly into the lane, as well as parked cycles in the lane ...

Yeah.  It's another "chicken and egg" one.  Although mostly just a minor irritation for me.

The goal would be the Dutch solution - genuine pedestrianised local "centres"* with obviously separate space for cycling and walking elsewhere **. 

We should be doing this properly "ahead of time" (e.g. before volume of cyclists / reduction in competition for any pedestrian space makes this self-enforcing).  We certainly shouldn't be paying for more "fight over scraps" shared use stuff especially not "sign it better" re-purposed footways...

* Which are going to be busy with people walking so likely cyclists (like motor vehicles) will naturally take the detours round the sides.  And park their bikes at the bike parking around the edges.  Oh - we don't have either of those?  Another one for the list!

** Except where one mode is almost absent and overall traffic is low.  On longer countryside sections between places the Dutch only build cycle paths - with few cyclists and minimal pedestrians this works fine.

peted76 wrote:

I am saddened that I've never seen this before today.. 

https://twitter.com/NoContextBrits/status/1597647847251640320?s=20&t=jsy...

..see.. twatter is good for some stuff.

Pfffft! I posted about that on yesterday's live blog:

hawkinspeter wrote:

This old clip made me chuckle: https://imgur.com/gallery/a841gyT

(Taken from https://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/23156738.watch-cars-crash-hilario...)

With you on that one. Ok, there's the sprint, but all the divving about and sipping champagne beforehand...it's not sport.

LeadenSkies wrote:

Careless and a little distracted by the binman, and an overreaction by Vine imho.

More like lazy and ignorant by the binman, as he was clearly going back to the cab leaving the bin in the cycle lane instead of returning it to whereever on the pavement it came from...

STiG911 wrote:

More like lazy and ignorant by the binman, as he was clearly going back to the cab leaving the bin in the cycle lane instead of returning it to whereever on the pavement it came from...

In his defence, round my way at least there are generally a couple of guys going ahead of the lorry pulling the paladins to the kerbside, a couple dragging them into the road, unloading them into the lorry and pushing them back to the kerbside, then a couple more guys following up behind to return them to their usual places, so although it was careless he probably wasn't just leaving it there.

Rendel Harris wrote:

STiG911 wrote:

More like lazy and ignorant by the binman, as he was clearly going back to the cab leaving the bin in the cycle lane instead of returning it to whereever on the pavement it came from...

...are generally a couple of guys going ahead of the lorry pulling the paladins to the kerbside, a couple dragging them into the road, unloading them into the lorry and pushing them back to the kerbside, then a couple more guys following up behind to return them to their usual places, so although it was careless he probably wasn't just leaving it there.

None such guys present = just leaving it there like a lazy twat. 

Do the job you're paid for, not half of it.

I agree the binman could have placed the bin more carefully but that may well have been the designated storage, at least temporarily. I don't know where it was exactly but there are plenty of areas in the City and the West End especially where commercial bins have to be placed kerbside, collected and taken in again within a very very short time window because there is nowhere on the street for them to be stored. It is unfortunate but when the city was laid out 1000+ years ago, they didn't consider how to wedge in cars, bikes and wheelie bins so the services today have to do the best with the layout they are working with. I am not sure if I would have stayed around with the like of Vine gobbing off, an apology was unlikely to cut it with him so why waste my breath.

"the designated storage, at least temporarily"

Wtf. Yet another troll ?

marmotte27 wrote:

"the designated storage, at least temporarily"

Wtf. Yet another troll ?

It's a bizarre take, but not trolling in my opinion.

No, definitely not a troll, in fact a very useful person to have commenting given their fire service work.

I'd say Vine is marmite, so you should not be surprised people give him short shrift.

When I had a short-lived stint in the City thirty plus years ago the rubbish had to be moved from the rear yard, placed on the pavement in their designated spot at a set time each day for collection and empty bins taken back in again within iirc 30 minutes, may have been less. Simply no other way to do to do it as no space in the street to store a bin and no vehicular access to the rear of the premises. For the short time in the late evening where they were collected they blocked a fair chunk of the pavement but no other option hence the strictly enforced stipulation that they were there for the minimum possible time. I presume it's still the same though I haven't worked up there since. If you want pubs, clubs, shops and offices in relatively narrow city streets laid out centuries ago then unfortunately you have to compromise occasionally.

Back in the 60s, bins were full of rotting food and nobody used bin liners. Bin lorries often were flatbed trucks with sliding doors over the load,  which might be left open (see below). They reaked.

Then there was the joy of the 1970s bin strikes.

Modern bin lorries are perfumed in comparison

London, London, London, London......

Whilst that's great news, it means absolutely nothing to the vast majority of people who don't live there and have to continuously look on in envy at London getting all the funding while the rest of the country gets crumbs at best.

True.

Green shoots though (don't worry, I'm not calling "bike boom"!)?  London's really a bunch of large towns stuck together (plus tube) though so there are maybe some transferrable lessons from there?  Cambridge doesn't look bad - although it's an outlier for other reasons anyway.  Other places?  York, Bristol?  Cardiff?  Bits of new towns / places developed around a certain period e.g. Peterborough have some fossilised cycle infra mini-networks (probably surprising to anyone who's driven there and there are all the UK issues).  Edinburgh where I stay certainly works for me as is, you can find lots of cyclists in places / at certain times and is building new stuff.  If you look at the overall modal share it's still pretty feeble though.

Owd Big 'Ead wrote:

London, London, London, London......

Whilst that's great news, it means absolutely nothing to the vast majority of people who don't live there and have to continuously look on in envy at London getting all the funding while the rest of the country gets crumbs at best.

Well, if nothing else, it might show what can be done with political will and the right investment.